God & The Burden of Proof…

I’m closer to the atheist side but you talking about pomposity is like NL talking about open mindedness. SOME followers followers of organized religion expect us to blindly accept the over the top ficticous mythology of the bible without a single shred of evidence. The fact that you paint ALL followers with the same brush is stereotypical, cheap and downright lazy.

The burden of proof is only with those who try to shove their religion down your or our collective throat. Not all believers, as this entry implies. Yes, Hitler, Pinochet, the Inquisitors and Walker Bush were Christian believers. So were/are Jimmy Carter, Martin Luther King Jr, Nelson Mandela and the man you so raved about recently Barack Obama. Explain that.

If you’re going to attack people, you need to make sure you’re attacking those who deserve it. Someone like NL tries to shove his bigotry down everyone’s throat via public policy. Someone Paula or My Angel do not. They don’t meet your burden of proof because they don’t care to convince you. Their belief is for themselves only. That you tar them all with the same brush is cheap, lazy b.s.

Popeye: Paula got hit with the brush because she couldn’t keep her religion to herself. She went to someone else’s diary and started an exchange by sounding off on someone else’s opinion about religion. While her comments were no where near as hostile as NL, that much I’ll give you, it was still no where near the her belief is for herself passive attitude you claim she has. She all for attacking hypocrisy when it comes to politics but her brain shuts off when it comes to the hypocrisy of the church. Sure she’ll sound off on the sex scandal and what not and she’ll protest to high heaven about the lack of evidence to go into Iraq but not the lack of evidence on the existence on a higher being. I’m sorry but I just can’t live with that kind of hypocrisy and ignorance.

No all people of faith want to preach or change your mind, and quite equally not all non believers seek the same. Evangelicals be they Faith based or Atheists are cut from the same cloth.

Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs (or non belief). I’m a Christian and I write about that at times, however no one is required to read those writings if they choose not to. I’m also a lay preacher and I don’t force my beliefs on anyone. I preach to those who share my beliefs and want to learn more. I believe in God and I don’t feel I’m required to prove that God exists to anyone. Not all believers try to force their beliefs down others’ throats. Sounds like you’ve experienced that, but don’t tar us all with the same brush.

Talk about getting someone’s knickers into a knot. The response to this entry is about what I’d expected it to be. While I absolutely hate any and all reference to the flying spaghetti monster, I understand the point your making. However, I am absolutely APPALLED that you don’t believe in the One Ring.

religion causes cancer?

This is where I’ll ask you for evidence. You claim she made certain comments. Please provide a link to the page in question so I can judge for myself. Thank you.

And you never answered my question. How do you explain the fact that Martin Luther King Jr and the pro-Jim Crow crowd were all Christian? That PW Botha and his crowd and Mandela and Tutu were all Christian? That Ian Paisley and John Hume are both Christian? That Walker Bush and Jimmy Carter are both Christian?

Ghandi is a good person too, doesn’t mean his religion is any more true either Popeye… A person should be judged by their actions, not what religous background them happen to worship every Sunday. I hate that people actually use that as some sort of litmus test to judging a person’s character…

Peter, I agree that a person should be judged by their actions and not their religion or lack there of, but maybe that’s why this entry seems unnecessarily harsh.

RYN: Her original comment that you tweaked out about was pretty mild. She didn’t criticize his views. She expressed her extremely mild disagreement with his which, if you notice, referred to her beliefs as ‘delusional.’ It was an opinion expressed in a public entry that accepted public notes. If he wasn’t bothered by this ridiculously mild disagreement

(“I don’t consider your belief that God does not exist blasphemy. It’s what you believe”), then why should you flip out over it? If anything, reading her comment makes your overreaction look even more hypersensitive and like someone looking to be offended. You’re a guy who comes to my diary and occasionally attacks me in far harsher terms (the sport salary cap issue comes to mind) that her

Than her extremely mild statement, which was entirely factual by the way.

I had an exchange with another diarist that you chose to comment upon. Pot, kettle thing. Why do I owe you a burden of proof. ARE you God? This entry only goes to prove one thing, some atheists make a religion of bashing faith. I don’t give a flying fart what you choose to believe. All I ask is the same courtesy.

AND I never judge a person’s character by church attendance. Peter, you are just hyper sensitive about this. I am not out to convert anyone. I have made my own religious views perfectly clear on my own diary. I am among the first to call out hypocrites and religious pomposity. Peter, you are suffering from rewligious pomposity. I still love you though.

LF, the whole character thing was a reponse to something Popeye said and was had nothing to do with anything you have said in your notes or in your diary. Just wanted to make sure that was clear.

Honestly, Peter, I think you’re barking up the wrong tree. Proof is not the point. You can’t prove there’s no God; I can’t prove there is. Nor would I want to, but that’s beside the point. Faith is an emotional process. I think you need to do some reading up on clinical psychology and why people believe or disbelieve. I can always back it up against psychology; how’s that for a God? Anyway,the reality is, as I said on Paula’s diary, that we are all agnostic. None of us knows if there’s a God, period.

By the way, atheism IS a belief. I simply cannot understand your rationale. You are stating that it’s not a belief but then you turn around and use the word “belief” to explain why you don’t believe in God (“we don’t believe in Sleeping Beauty . . .”). You’re mixing apples and oranges, anyway. Belief NEVER has to be necessarily predicated on evidence. My fiance believes in ghosts. Idon’t have any evidence for ghosts, but who cares? He believes. You say there’s no evidence for God; that’s your belief. A religious person would give you a ton of evidence for the existence of God. See what I mean?

FallingDog: Now that you’re finished splitting hairs, just because I used the word to describe why some people accept something as fictional and something just as absurd as not fictional doesn’t magically prove you right. You are twisting words to appease yourself and if that works for you, whatever. I stated that the reason why numerous ficticious works are not accepted as fact is one of many reasons why the many religious myths, which are just as absurd, shouldn’t be accepted as fact and regarded as fiction as well. So your twisting of word belief in that sentence is a shallow misquote.

Stirring the pot? Nice. I give it an eight out of ten!

Peter: You are the one twisting concepts here. Just own up to your non-BELIEF. Atheism is a belief. Period. Do not go on as if it were fact. It’s not. No more than a religious tenet is fact.

I didn’t see any pomposity in your above entry. FD, who I consider a friend, and I disagree on this. It’s like people who defend not being educated as being unnecessary to a good life. It can be true enough, but being educated will generally lead to a better life. I would not have let my child believe there were monsters (or ghosts) under her bed, simply because she says she believes in them.I do care and would prove to her that there are no monsters under her bed. I don’t believe there is no God, I know it because no credible evidence has been presented to support the argument for the existence of God. I don’t believe in elves, fairies, Satan, Thor, etc. I know they don’t exist! But the jury is still out on the flying spaghetti monster! 😉

i agree completely with this entry! i saw you note one of my fav’s diaries… i like your writings!

As a Christian myself, I don’t feel the need to ‘prove’ God exists and I certainly wouldn’t accept somebody ‘disproving’ it because they can’t. And along with that comes the way to Heaven that I believe in so grab a bible and look up John 3:16. You can believe or not, your choice. Still an eight but with a bullet. 🙂

…I believe in a galaxy far, far away.

what kind of sauce is the sphaghetti monster covered in? 🙂

I’ve got to say, Peter… you’re more of an evangelist for atheism than most Christians I know personally are for God. I mean that in love, though. 🙂 And if you wonder why I chose “evangelist”… well, what else would I use to describe someone who says, “What I believe is right, and the rest of you are dead wrong, case closed”? Very, very devout you are. But that’s not necessarily a bad thing.