The Pope’s Latest Pronouncement **edited**

Hey.

 

Saw this in today’s BBC News online.

Gay groups angry at Pope remarks

Okay.  quote from the article:

"Speaking on Monday, Pope Benedict said that saving humanity from homosexual or transsexual behaviour was as important as protecting the environment."

In other words, the LGBT community is as much of a threat to the world as tearing down the rain forests.

Talk about alienating folks.

If I had ever considered going back to the Catholic Church, they’ve reduced the probability from single digits to zero.

 

 ***  Edits  ****   (actually, a rather big edit)

 

Okay, so, a little research, and I also heard an interview with some folks on BBC today.

 

Here’s an extract from the pope’s address

On ‘gender’

"What is often expressed and signified with the word ‘gender’ leads to the human auto-emancipation from creation and from the Creator. The human being wants to make himself on his own and to decide always and exclusively by himself about what concerns him.

"But, in so doing, the human being lives against the truth and against the Spirit creator. Rain forests deserve, yes, our protection but the human being – as a creature which contains a message that is not in contradiction with his freedom but is the condition of his freedom – does not deserve it less."

 

So, apparently, the pope’s address never actually mentioned the words "homosexuality" or "transsexuals".  I’m suspecting that those terms came from the BBC interpretation of the original. 

As someone suggested on the radio, the interpretation could be different.  The pope could have been referring to the unfortunate desire of women to be emancipated and have equal rights with men (like, saying Mass.  All the girls want to say Mass.  I overhear those bathroom conversations…)   

 

The other interpretation is that they (the Vatican) is hiding behind words, and mincing definitions.  "We never mentioned homosexuals in this address" the representative kept saying.  He kept talking about marriage (for procreation, he actually said) and I think he mentioned something about gender roles.

 

So, he doesn’t like boys acting like girls, or girls acting like boys, or either side doing the other side’s jobs… 

 

So they weasel-worded a statement that hit everything they don’t like without being explicit about it.  Gay couples violate their gender rules, transsexuals violate their gender rules, women wanting to say Mass violate their gender rules. 

According to the spokesman, the vatican representative, allowing and accepting these changing gender roles will cause our whole society to fail, to collapse.  A bit of a catastrophic vision, I must say. 

But I can see their logic, although I don’t agree.

 

What’s the worst thing that can happen to them?  Having women priests. That’s just my guess right now.  But, if they give an inch on anyone having different gender roles, then that’s what would eventually happen.  And they can’t have that, so they can’t let allow any flexibility in gender roles. 

 

So, it’s not just about LGBT.  It’s about women’s rights, men’s rights for that matter (following the logic above, they might in fact object to stay-at-home dad’s for all we know).  They seem to object to marriage that’s not for procreation  – oh, he did mention that the other reason for sex was to "support the couple in strengthening their relationship" whatever the hell that means.

I’m afraid this pope is hanging the church on a very fragile philosophy.  And fragile things break easily. 

 

I’ll go out on a limb and make a prediction here…   within the next 10 years, if this current pope hangs in there, then the church is going to get more and more strict, to the point of basically requiring pledges of belief from its folks so that they can keep coming to church.  And, there will be a massive protest, fractioning of the church, and it’ll end up with a hard core of very devout, almost dangerous supporters, and everyone else will have to go somewhere else, perhaps forming a more inclusive, kinder version. 

 

I find the evolution of societies and cultures fascinating, even when it’s not always in my favor.  Just fascinating.  And no, I don’t sit around watching paint dry.  😉

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December 23, 2008

I am a Catholic and the pope has no relevance for me. This is the man who was part of the cover-up of child rape. My personal opinion, because I do believe in God and Heaven and Hell, is that the holier than thous will pay the highest price for their sins. The Church is NOT about the pope. It’s about Christ and the people. Do you think that Jesus would have worn silk robes and had people kiss his ring? The hierarchy are puffed up with their own importance.

December 23, 2008

ryn: There is a whole branch of medical ethics that debates things like this on a daily basis. Most medical centers have an ethics committee that deals with these issues. I’ve only experienced these discussions from the hospital side, but I’m sure the insurers have similar groups. They usualy classify things as medically necessary, quality-of-life, and elective. If you have limited funding available, you concentrate on the medically necessary, which usually means there is a disease or accident that is life-threatening. One good example is patients I see come in with Stage IV pancreatic cancer. It has a survival rate of zero. We can apply some treatments to prolong life a bit, but at a very low quality of life. If the patient demands treatment, and their insurer will pay for it, hospitals won’t refuse. But ethically, hundreds of thousands of dollars are spent for what I ultimately see as prolonging suffering. Is that good medicine? Not in my opinion. There is a ton of reading on the topic. One good book on the subject is: The Handbook of Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgender Public Health: A Practitioner’s Guide to Service.

December 23, 2008

well, it is what Catholics do best, alienate people that is.

December 23, 2008

Stupid, stupid, STUPID comment. If these idiots in charge of the Church looked at the Bible properly, they’d see that Jesus loved EVERYBODY and wanted us to do the same. So much for spreading joy and goodwill, eh?! I’m so glad I don’t worship as a Catholic anymore, religion just causes problems. Sigh.

December 23, 2008

Have a wonderful Holiday!

December 23, 2008

I am Catholic, but don’t practice any religion. Reading that just pisses me off to no end how dare him!

December 23, 2008

All I can think is “yes, because homosexuals are just so much like acid rain and the green house effect.” Not being Christian, I haven’t read the Bible to cover to cover, but I’m pretty sure that there’s something in there about “loving thy neighbor as thy would thyself” and about God having the final say in whether someone is good or bad. Being the Pope, I kind of think he should know that stuff. Hugs, John

December 23, 2008

The Catholic church has managed to last this long, and many threats, like Luther, have been predicted to bring about their end. Yet here they still are. I doubt anything will change that in our lifetimes.

December 23, 2008

How come ? We keep hearing about Priests who prefer boys ?

December 24, 2008

Interesting entry. Odd that the popeÂ’s words need translating and interpretive study, just like the Bible. I would like the comfort of religion, but this is just another reason why I choose to walk my own spiritual path. Whichever interpretation one believes of the popeÂ’s speech, it was judgmental, without compassion and divisive.

I think the purpose of ‘The Church’ has always been to define and constrain, to manage the otherwise unruly impulses of the unwashed masses. One can see that they take their job seriously but in modern times they seem to have forgotten themselves (high on incense and privilege as they are.) I’m guessing Jesus would say that they only stand so tall because we are on our knees. 🙂

Merry Christmas to you & Sweety. Lots of love to you both. xo

December 26, 2008

My mother used to say that “If you can’t say something nice, don’t say anything at all.” Hmm… The only nice thing I can say about Catholicism is that they have very aethetically attractive architecture. 😛